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Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by John Goodman, Dec 30, 2013.
His comma usage should be a dead giveaway if you think he might be posing as someone else.
I'm tired of this illogical talking point:
Taking down a statue does not equal erasing history. How many statues of Hitler are left in Germany (I actually don't know but assume its one or none)?
Having a statue of a person or event memorializes it and celebrates it. Taking the statue down, ie stopping the memorialization, does not erase history. There is a slight relationship between the two but they are different.
Just so I'm clear, you don't think there's anything racist about the Mayor Rizzo statue, but you are in favor of putting it away? I mean, I guess there is some kind of logic to that if you're primary objective is to stop protests and save money spent on policing the statue. Fans of Rizzo certainly aren't, and probably won't be screaming as much about its removal as those who want it gone. But in that regard, if you don't have a problem with Rizzo's statue, you're giving into your position the same way City Hall seems to be...allowing protestors to run the show simply because they're costly and loud.
I do have some Sympathy, for Blacks and LGBT under Rizzo the 70s understand how they may feel. But I read, blacks close to him, Policeman, Bodyguards, Etc. say he was not a Racist, Lawbreakers have ! As for force, he knocked out my boyhood friends Fathers eye out, he gave Rizzo the scar he had, he got an Eye patch for life, Every Cop that went to arrest him, got a beatdown until 4-5 held him and he got a Blackjack to the face, he was Italian. Lawbreakers got a beatdown. Girard College protests yes I'd say excessive force, and Language was used, on kids it's opened to all races in late 60s. I'd say all Lawbreakers got it hard. No Rizzo ! Phila might have burned to the ground in 1970 like LA did later, from Riots. This division will. The Hatred will, Riots will, and its growing. People say boycott Chinatown, blaming Helen Gym for this. Real ugly people on opposite side. Real Haters. I have no problem with the Statue. If it goes to South Philly. The protesters and defaciers, are only go to South Philly and meet up. Mayor Kenny, will tell Police to Stand Down. We will have, Bullhorns, Marches, around the Statue and the Police have orders do nothing, let it go. At all future Protests... a Racism, protest magnet. Helen Gym far away, the Mayor too. They will be glad, that it's not my neighborhood, and away from Center City. This is wrong, this is divisive, this will only make more hatred...Add a Statue, someone of Honor waiving back. Why I'm for Leaving the Statue, right there ! Not moving ! Not a Racist ! Not giving in ! Not a Disgrace the Statue ! This is a War on the Police ! With, Pawns falling for it !
Off Topic: going on Vacation 2 Wk's, discuss Corruption, Racism, in Philadelphia I'm done with the Statue. Maybe be back, maybe not. ! Good Luck ! Not answering back too !
Could probably do with a less trollish headline from PhillyMag, but a fascinating juxtaposition and conversation starter by any measure. Note that this new piece, "All Power to All People," will only be in place until November 19, as part of the Monument Lab project around the city.
Take That, Frank Rizzo: Behold This 800-Pound Black Power Pick | Phillymag.com
Is Mayor Kenny the Mayor Rizzo reincarnate?
Mayor Kenney once sponsored a bill to rename MSB the "Frank L. Rizzo Municipal Services Building"
Leave it to PhillyMag to troll
I really hope it finds a permanent place nearby when the Monument Lab project ends. I love this piece. I think it's a great way to get people talking about not just Rizzo, but racial tension in general, and it's more lasting than simply taking something down (regardless of whether Rizzo comes down). It's also, artistically, just a really interesting piece of art. I hope it stays in Philly, it could become a landmark.
I think it should stay right where it is for the juxtaposition factor.
People are talking for sure. Below is a screengrab of a small excerpt in the South Philly Born and Raised facebook group yesterday (with Jayfar joining in as Joy Morelli [since my regular fb profile is banned there] ). The thread, with *hundreds* of comments has since been deleted.
What I find interesting is the artist's title, "All Power to All People." It deliberately plays off the "All Lives Matter" mantra, but I don't think the artist is being sarcastic. Art is rarely that intentionally self-aware. But the artwork definitely brings those people out of the woodwork, and that may have been the point of the title. I don't think the artist is trolling that audience with the title because, let's face it, that audience doesn't even know the work has a title. But he's made his point.
Essentially, he's forcing us to ask why so many preaching "All Lives Matter" would be so offended by a sculpture titularly dedicated to "All People." Using something less afrocentric may have been more artistically subtle, but public art doesn't really traffic in subtlety. He hammered the audience on the head with an afro pick and a black fist, then turned the tables on an exclusively white mantra by saying "all lives matter" from a black perspective.
Sure, "all lives matter," but not when a black man says so.
Maybe watching Twin Peaks has made me over-analyze everything I see, but I think this piece is ****ing brilliant.
When people preach "All Lives Matter," they're really saying, "all lives matter when straight white men say they matter." They want to be regarded as good people, but they're frustrated when they're not the ones making the statement, not the ones in control, not the deciders.
When a white family commissions a statue of a socially contentious mayor, or protects a Confederate statue of an ancestor, everyone is expected to regard it in the context of history, respect differing opinions, or simply "ignore it if you don't like it."
But when a black man erects a statue with afrocentric implications, even when the title is blatantly all-inclusive, it's utterly offensive and must be removed. How ironic they call us "snowflakes." But that thin skin is precisely what the anger over this statue is all about: "white people" didn't commission it, "white people" didn't sign off on it, "white people" didn't ask a black man to design a "black sculpture," even if it's literally dedicated to "All People."
Sure, "all lives matter," but only when straight white men have control over who says that and how. No afrocentric statue should ever represent "All People," despite the notion that every statue of a buttoned up Colonial Founding Father is allegedly meant to do just that. Academically, I think this piece is one of the most profound in Philadelphia. Personally and socially, I think it's beautiful because it does represent the power of "All People," all people who want to embrace equality in an incredibly dynamic and diverse city like Philadelphia.
Mattering or empowerment is not, or should not, be something bestowed upon us by straight white men. We all matter regardless, and it goes in every direction. Black, female, immigrant, LGBT...minorities shouldn't wait for the great straight white male outside to feel comfortable enough to invite us into their cocoon. We, like this artist, can be inviting them into our wild and wonderfully diverse worlds. And I think that is exactly what this piece is all about. Again, I might be over-analyzing. But that's the whole point of great art. And I just think this is wonderful.
Jayfar, I was perusing those other pages -- the Taking Back Our Streets (real and parody), and they are comedy gold. Actually, sad, scary, and comedy gold all at the same time. I thought all was well between new and old in SP. Holy shit. A few trolls have tried to gin up the hate machine between new and old in my corner of the FMT, but thankfully it went nowhere -- for now.
Frank Rizzo Statue - Location - Location - Location
I have to fully concede that Frank Rizzo's statue in front of the Municipal Services Building across from City Hall is there for another 25 years til the last of us Boomers goes to our eternal reward. As we all know premature plans to send the statue south to Marconi Plaza in South Philly is Fake News.
Frank Rizzo - Wikipedia
One of Philly's greatest patron's and French immigrants (from the French Revolution period) Stephen Girard 1850-1831 - His statue has migrated over the centuries 19th, 20th and 21st centuries from City Hall to Reyburn Plaza to out behind the Museum in the Park, as his fame and memory from Philly's consciousness fades. Or did they send old Stevey, has he finally made it to Manayunk? LOL
Stephen Girard - Wikipedia
In any case, Frank's statue is safe for the moment. Examination of a sampling of news data, lots and lots it btw, suggests to me that Frank might have been a narcissist if he were born rich. But more likely he recognized the importance of publicity all through his police career. That or he had John Travolta's publicist out of college to help him along. Or a couple of news reporters always in need of filler on a back page in return for other favors etc. later on etc. Wink. Nod.
The earliest clip suggests an early connection to State Rep James H. J. Tate's home neighborhood around W Hunting Park Ave near Simon Gratz High which I bet got good police response and protection with Frank as a foot soldier in that station house. And Frank's rise seems to parallel old Jimmy Tate's blessings from the fates etc.
Nothing Frank in his day didn't do that the old Irish Micks like my great great grandad did on the old Police force in its day, did not do or would not do in terms of serving and stabilizing the community.
Grandfathered into the fabric of 20th century history is old hiz honor Mayor Frank Rizzo.
Inquirer 5 Nov 1945
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Inquirer 17 Jan 1952
Inquirer 17 Jan 1952
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Actually, the artist was not playing off of "All Lives Matter."
“The phrase ‘power to all the people’ actually was a mantra of the Black Panther movement,” said Thomas, who said he decries the idea that the movement was racist or antiwhite."
Mural Arts adds an Afro pick sculpture to the plaza with Rizzo's statue
That's cool to know. I saw him talking to someone on the plaza one morning and I wish I'd gone over to say hi. I'd be curious if he intended the title's homage to the Black Panther movement to echo the "All Lives Matter" mantra, or if he even thought of it at all. I like to think that art is deliberately vague, interpretive, and subjective. It still resonates with me for the same reasons I mentioned before, perhaps even more now knowing where a title so close to "All Lives Matter" actually originated.
Location not yet determined.
Statue of fmr. Philly Mayor Frank Rizzo to be moved | 6ABC
"The city said the decision came after 4,000 submissions came in following their call to the public for help in deciding the statue's fate."
Kenney would have us believe that he made the decision to move the statue after he received 4000 letters. I don't care whether the statue stays or goes, but the decision to move it was no doubt made within days of Helen Gym's tweet. The charade that the Kenney administration concocted with this request for letters to help make the decision is pathetic and he is beneath contempt.
What a Disgrace. You don’t even have the decency, to make a personal phone call, to the Family...We all have to take the Good with the Bad !!! Tell them, we came to a conclusion, We’re moving the Statue...they learn it from reporters, then blame it on a Communication Staff Error...