Gentrification in Camden?

[ArcticSplash]

Poverty numbers are grim in N.J.

[y.lama]

Poverty numbers are grim in N.J.

There is no such animal - besides the small cooper grant neighborhood I have no idea what that person is talking about.

[ArcticSplash]

There is no such animal - besides the small cooper grant neighborhood I have no idea what that person is talking about.

I was thinking along similar lines. I've never seen in Camden any area being bulldozed to make way for $150K+ housing.

[Litter Box]

I was thinking along similar lines. I've never seen in Camden any area being bulldozed to make way for $150K+ housing.

What were they going to replace the prison with ?

[thoth]

Are prisoners counted as part of a city's general population in the census? If so the demo and relocation of a few thousand prisoners would make a noticeable dent in the city's poverty rate.

There is a tiny part of Cooper Point that never really struck me as up and coming, although it is nicer than most of Camden.
Camden - Google Maps

The most noticeable improvements have been the student ghetto they've built up near Rutgers-Camden in Cooper Grant.

[billy ross]

Are prisoners counted as part of a city's general population in the census? If so the demo and relocation of a few thousand prisoners would make a noticeable dent in the city's poverty rate.

There is a tiny part of Cooper Point that never really struck me as up and coming, although it is nicer than most of Camden.
Camden - Google Maps

The most noticeable improvements have been the student ghetto they've built up near Rutgers-Camden in Cooper Grant.

Yes. A few years ago Philly's numbers jumped because institutionalized people were counted. We've been on a roll ever since.

[raider.adam]

Are prisoners counted as part of a city's general population in the census? If so the demo and relocation of a few thousand prisoners would make a noticeable dent in the city's poverty rate.

There is a tiny part of Cooper Point that never really struck me as up and coming, although it is nicer than most of Camden.
Camden - Google Maps

The most noticeable improvements have been the student ghetto they've built up near Rutgers-Camden in Cooper Grant.

Yeah, it is a routine fight over who gets to claim the population of inmates.

[radiocolin]

There was talk of building condos to replace the prison. There isn't a supermarket in the town but they want to build condos. Camden is doomed. Which truly is a shame when you consider what it could be if it were a suitable compliment to Center City with 24 hour train service over the bridge.

[thoth]

There was talk of building condos to replace the prison. There isn't a supermarket in the town but they want to build condos. Camden is doomed. Which truly is a shame when you consider what it could be if it were a suitable compliment to Center City with 24 hour train service over the bridge.

They already built condos in Camden. Any place has the capacity to change. When you're at the bottom there is nowhere to go but up.

[desolate]

it's the DRPA's $5 toll that sentences Camden to death. While you can go back and forth on Patco, it's harder and more expensive to deo recreational and shopping trips. Things that help drive places like K of P and Philadelphia.

The PPA's evil but we don't charge PA suburban visitors and $5 Cover Charge per visit.

Camden does.

[randomuser]

Since when is Camden a suburb? It seems like a city that was in existence for almost as long as Philadelphia to me. Then again, maybe I'm not up to date with the latest changes in the meanings of words to suit people's own views. Oh well.

I wouldn't be surprised if it were being gentrified either. The parts of Philadelphia nearest Camden right over the river have been getting gentrified for the past decade or so.

[radiocolin]

Since when is Camden a suburb? It seems like a city that was in existence for almost as long as Philadelphia to me. Then again, maybe I'm not up to date with the latest changes in the meanings of words to suit people's own views. Oh well.

I wouldn't be surprised if it were being gentrified either. The parts of Philadelphia nearest Camden right over the river have been getting gentrified for the past decade or so.

Camden's roots are as a suburb of Philadelphia.

Today, it's mostly parking lots on the water front behind the Aquarium, ballpark, and ship. Cooper Hospital in the middle, and shells upon shells of dilapidated rowhomes and empty lots everywhere else. Beyond the waterfront attractions, there is nowhere anyone wants to go.

Photo Album - Imgur

[daninpa]

There isn't a supermarket in the town but they want to build condos.

There actually is a full-service supermarket in the city. I forgot the name but they also had another location elsewhere. Their meat counter was huge.

Here it is: Cousins Supermarket There's also a PathMark in the city.

[Litter Box]

[QUOTE=daninpa;498622]There actually is a full-service supermarket in the city. I forgot the name but they also had another location elsewhere. Their meat counter was huge.

Here it is: Cousins Supermarket There's also a PathMark in the city.[/QUoOTE]

I think the Super Market is an ALDI or something like that.

[MariusPontmercy]

it's the DRPA's $5 toll that sentences Camden to death. While you can go back and forth on Patco, it's harder and more expensive to deo recreational and shopping trips. Things that help drive places like K of P and Philadelphia.

The PPA's evil but we don't charge PA suburban visitors and $5 Cover Charge per visit.

Camden does.

So South Jersey doesn't provide enough of a market for a small city like Camden, it has to draw on people from Philly and PA and that's why it is the way it is?

I agree the bridge tolls don't help, but what's holding Camden back is 99% comprised of other factors.

[Brian616]

Camden won't really gentrify, I'm afraid, until Fairmount/SWCC/NoLibs/etc. are have Rittenhouse-level housing prices. Right now there are just too many affordable neighborhoods next to downtown for anyone to want to cross the Delaware.

[the mule]

Camden won't really gentrify, I'm afraid, until Fairmount/SWCC/NoLibs/etc. are have Rittenhouse-level housing prices. Right now there are just too many affordable neighborhoods next to downtown for anyone to want to cross the Delaware.

This is true to a large extent; Philadelphia has decades worth of vacant parcels waiting to be rehabbed/built on and infrastructure and businesses to accommodate the growth. That becomes less relevant if Camden is able to attract businesses to create its own population draw. The Cooper Grant development is a microcosm of this, it's driven almost entirely by Rutgers. I know Camden is in dire financial straits but if they could offer big enough incentives for businesses to locate there, there could be some localized population growth to slowly start the path up from the bottom.

[thoth]

I wonder if we'll be able to find parking.



But seriously, this is what you get when you put a bunch of South Jersey suburban legislators in charge of city redevelopment projects.

[randomuser]

Camden's roots are as a suburb of Philadelphia.

Today, it's mostly parking lots on the water front behind the Aquarium, ballpark, and ship. Cooper Hospital in the middle, and shells upon shells of dilapidated rowhomes and empty lots everywhere else. Beyond the waterfront attractions, there is nowhere anyone wants to go.

Photo Album - Imgur

No, they aren't. I don't know if maybe it's the whole Hoboken/Jersey City/Newark-NYC thing but everybody wants to label places suburbs due to proximity these days. Suburbs didn't even exist when Camden was a power. At most, it was a satellite city and even that is a stretch. Most people don't see Camden as a suburb when it comes to things like their history with basketball or with culture, among other things.

This is true to a large extent; Philadelphia has decades worth of vacant parcels waiting to be rehabbed/built on and infrastructure and businesses to accommodate the growth. That becomes less relevant if Camden is able to attract businesses to create its own population draw. The Cooper Grant development is a microcosm of this, it's driven almost entirely by Rutgers. I know Camden is in dire financial straits but if they could offer big enough incentives for businesses to locate there, there could be some localized population growth to slowly start the path up from the bottom.

That's already been happening for a few years now. They've pulled at least one big business from Philadelphia.

Either way, it's not the total population numbers that matter but the makeup of them. Just like with every other city (like Philadelphia for example) that has seen population growth, the growth started before it showed in population numbers but it didn't show until the number of people moving in outnumbered the number of people leaving. What matters though is people moving into any city, because even NYC has people that move out all the time yet that gets majorly cancelled out by the many who move there as well as the many who still stay.

I wonder if we'll be able to find parking.



But seriously, this is what you get when you put a bunch of South Jersey suburban legislators in charge of city redevelopment projects.

Not to mention North Jersey state legislators who only care about New York.

[RashadZak]

Every time I cross over on patco I still can't help but notice the completely windowless former RCA tower near the Victor building that Dranoff was supposed to redevelop into condos... Also reminisce of childhood when there was still a sizable portion of abandoned RCA sprawling out below the Ben Frankln bridge.





Sad what deindustrialization has done in cities, especially Jersey cities where as mentioned, suburban politicians could not have cared less.

At least the new rutgers dorm building with the multicolored side doesn't look half bad. Sadly, eds and meds are all the development that's left there these days.