Converging on Philadelphia, but how?

**CComMack** · 05-25-2010, 10:17 PM

Hi, my girlfriend and I are moving to Philly this summer, and we're looking for advice.

First, the boilerplate:

When are you moving? This summer; date flexible but before or on August 15.
Where are you coming from? Him: Nevada Her: Spanish Harlem, New York City.
Why are you moving? We're sick of being in a long-distance relationship, and trying to engineer living together.
Where will you be working? Here's the ridiculousness: Him: From home some days, other days from South Jersey. Her: Claymont, DE, 5x weekly.
Have you been here yet? Yes. We're both Swarthmore alums. He spent a subsequent year living in Manayunk and have generally explored various parts of the city; she has much less experience in the city proper.

Will you buy or rent? Renting
If renting, are you looking for an apartment, a townhouse or loft? How much can you spend? Looking for something with at least two bedrooms, for various sanity-related purposes. Our preferred rent range is $1,000-$1,200/mo.
Do you prefer hi-rise or walk up? Slight preference for walkup; not a huge deal.

Are you married or single? Do you have children? This is basically the trial run for whether we can stand each other enough to get married and have kids, so "not yet".
Do you have pets? I have a nice set of allergies.
Do you want or need a yard? No and no
Are you keeping a car? We would prefer not to.
Do you prefer bustling activity or calm and quiet? A happy medium, please. Right over a bar and on a desolate alley where no one goes are both terrible prospects.

What do you want to be closest to?
Work
Shopping
Basic services (supermarket, drugstore, etc.)
Nightlife
Train or subway stations

Priorities are: R2 stations, basic services, NJT/PATCO stations. In that order. *Lack* of nightlife would be just fine by us, but we don't particularly expect that to happen.

Do you want to live with people of a similar age, race, religion or sexual preference or do you prefer a diverse neighborhood? We're pretty diverse in and of ourselves. As long as the neighbors aren't bigots, we should be fine anywhere.

So, additional notes: Since we both have long reverse commutes, we'd like to keep those as simple as possible, with priority given to hers because it's daily and mine isn't. We know, then, roughly, that we should be primarily looking in parts of Graduate Hospital, Fitler Square, WashWest, and Chinatown, although our price range will lock us out of a lot. Mostly, though, neither of us has a real clue how to do a Philly apartment search remotely. I'm 2000+ miles away until August. She has work in NY on weekdays through early July. A local friend of ours might be able to look around for us in evenings, but we would have to use his time sparingly. In terms of prior experience, she has used an apartment broker in NYC when procuring her current apartment four years ago, but that was NYC, where apartment brokers swarm like orcs. I and my roommates found our place in Manayunk on Craigslist, but we had a lot of time to devote to that process. Given that, what would you recommend as our path forward?

**phillycat** · 05-25-2010, 10:59 PM

My suggestion would be for your ladyfriend to get a sublet from Craigslist for July-August and look around in person. You really don't know what you are getting unless you look at it yourself. you will also have a lot more lease options in September (that's when a lot of leases start). There are lots of sublet options in the summer in Philly. That's what we did when we moved here and it made things much easier. Good luck!

**3rd&Brown** · 05-25-2010, 11:41 PM

Dude.

Welcome. As far as commutes are concerned, yours are hardly "long". Totally doable. Hers might be 35 minutes max, as it is in the reverse direction. Could even be as short as 25 minutes (45 minutes to 1 hour commutes are not uncommon here).

Depending on where in South Jersey you are, yours could be even less. Much of Camden County is only 10-15 minutes from much of Center City.

That being said, if I were you, I'd consider something on the east side of Center City (Old City, Northern Liberties, maybe even Bella Vista or Washington Square West). BV and NLibs are best if you plan to keep a car, as parking is easiest, but I suggest that side of the city b/c there are many on-ramps for 95, which will make commuting to DE more tolerable.

BV and WW are more central, so a car will be less of a necessity on the weekends, etc.

As far as public transit goes, NLibs, Old City, and WW are all on the Market-Frankford El. WW also has access to the Broad Street Line and is close to a few PATCO stations. But, parking will definitely be more challenging there than in the other 'hoods.

Is her workplace near a train station?

**redpinstripes** · 05-26-2010, 12:07 AM

Welcome. Good first post and good luck.

Phillycat is correct that Craigslist for a summer sublet is a good idea. Plenty of grad and professional school types need to rent thier places for the summer.

There are also a handful of folks on the board who own rental properties and a few realtors who may be able to offer assistance (w/o seeking personal gain).

Since you know the area a bit, is there any neighborhood that you are leaning towards? Seems like South Philadelphia would suit you both best as far as commuting. There are definitley a number of transit geeks than can help w/commute info better than I. If you have a car that is paid off (or 2) it might be worth keeping one. But, if you dont have one, buying one shouldnt be necessary.

I envy you the girlfirend who is willing to move w/o a ring. Trying to do the same engineering as you with the prerequisite is tough tough tough.

Keep checking in w/ questions. Folks here enjoy helping new arrivals to the area. Once you make it, though, all bets are off.

**billy ross** · 05-26-2010, 06:13 AM

Originally Posted by CComMack

Hi, my girlfriend and I are moving to Philly this summer, and we're looking for advice.

First, the boilerplate:

When are you moving? This summer; date flexible but before or on August 15.
Where are you coming from? Him: Nevada Her: Spanish Harlem, New York City.
Why are you moving? We're sick of being in a long-distance relationship, and trying to engineer living together.
Where will you be working? Here's the ridiculousness: Him: From home some days, other days from South Jersey. Her: Claymont, DE, 5x weekly.
Have you been here yet? Yes. We're both Swarthmore alums. He spent a subsequent year living in Manayunk and have generally explored various parts of the city; she has much less experience in the city proper.

Will you buy or rent? Renting
If renting, are you looking for an apartment, a townhouse or loft? How much can you spend? Looking for something with at least two bedrooms, for various sanity-related purposes. Our preferred rent range is $1,000-$1,200/mo.
Do you prefer hi-rise or walk up? Slight preference for walkup; not a huge deal.

Are you married or single? Do you have children? This is basically the trial run for whether we can stand each other enough to get married and have kids, so "not yet".
Do you have pets? I have a nice set of allergies.
Do you want or need a yard? No and no
Are you keeping a car? We would prefer not to.
Do you prefer bustling activity or calm and quiet? A happy medium, please. Right over a bar and on a desolate alley where no one goes are both terrible prospects.

What do you want to be closest to?
Work
Shopping
Basic services (supermarket, drugstore, etc.)
Nightlife
Train or subway stations

Priorities are: R2 stations, basic services, NJT/PATCO stations. In that order. *Lack* of nightlife would be just fine by us, but we don't particularly expect that to happen.

Do you want to live with people of a similar age, race, religion or sexual preference or do you prefer a diverse neighborhood? We're pretty diverse in and of ourselves. As long as the neighbors aren't bigots, we should be fine anywhere.

So, additional notes: Since we both have long reverse commutes, we'd like to keep those as simple as possible, with priority given to hers because it's daily and mine isn't. We know, then, roughly, that we should be primarily looking in parts of Graduate Hospital, Fitler Square, WashWest, and Chinatown, although our price range will lock us out of a lot. Mostly, though, neither of us has a real clue how to do a Philly apartment search remotely. I'm 2000+ miles away until August. She has work in NY on weekdays through early July. A local friend of ours might be able to look around for us in evenings, but we would have to use his time sparingly. In terms of prior experience, she has used an apartment broker in NYC when procuring her current apartment four years ago, but that was NYC, where apartment brokers swarm like orcs. I and my roommates found our place in Manayunk on Craigslist, but we had a lot of time to devote to that process. Given that, what would you recommend as our path forward?

Depending upon how tight your budget is and how long you're willing to commute, the R6 Norristown generally goes to the Claymont station, single seat. You'd lose time going through Center City, though. You could also get something deeper into South Philly and take the sub (or bike) uptown to connect with PATCO or the R2. I have a friend near the Italian Market who keeps a crappy bike and claims that it is an 8 minute ride from home to Market East; he feels comfortable locking it up at Market East all day since it isn't a theft target. Similarly, you may wish to consider Old Kensington (between Front and 6th, above Girard). You'd find bargains there but it is convenient to the el and to CC. It is historically a racially open / welcoming area, unlike next door Fishtown.

**Sycamore** · 05-26-2010, 08:19 AM

When I moved out of state, I stayed in a hotel while I apartment shopped. I recommend getting a sublet while you're apartment hunting. It's hard to do remotely.

**redpinstripes** · 05-26-2010, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by billy ross

Depending upon how tight your budget is and how long you're willing to commute, the R6 Norristown generally goes to the Claymont station, single seat. You'd lose time going through Center City, though. You could also get something deeper into South Philly and take the sub (or bike) uptown to connect with PATCO or the R2. I have a friend near the Italian Market who keeps a crappy bike and claims that it is an 8 minute ride from home to Market East; he feels comfortable locking it up at Market East all day since it isn't a theft target. Similarly, you may wish to consider Old Kensington (between Front and 6th, above Girard). You'd find bargains there but it is convenient to the el and to CC. It is historically a racially open / welcoming area, unlike next door Fishtown.

Might as well not confuse him with all the R2/R6 business. That isnt the lingo anymore. I dont like it but our way of discussing commuter rail lines is gonna have to change. SEPTA | Regional Rail Schedules

**CComMack** · 05-26-2010, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by redpinstripes

Might as well not confuse him with all the R2/R6 business. That isnt the lingo anymore. I dont like it but our way of discussing commuter rail lines is gonna have to change. SEPTA | Regional Rail Schedules

Heh. Perhaps I should have mentioned that I'm fairly adept at all things SEPTA. This includes the upcoming nomenclature change to Wilmington Line and Manayunk/Norristown Line, which I support.

In any event, we checked, and the train that gets her to work (a short walk away from Claymont Station) on time, originates at Suburban Station. So no run-through magic available.

**3rd&Brown** · 05-26-2010, 12:17 PM

Here's an idea...

I'd consider living in the western portion of Graduate Hospital or Fitler Square, near the South Street Bridge.

Your lady could easily walk across the bridge (when it reopens) and pick up the train at the University City station. That cuts 7 minutes off of the train ride, 76 is very accessible there as well (which leads to 95 Southbound), should she need to drive.

For the days you need to get the Jersey, you can truck is up to 16th & Locust, which is a bit of a hike but not obnoxious. I think that's the closest PATCO station.

**ACG** · 05-26-2010, 12:25 PM

I vote for the sublet or short-term lease idea so you both can be here to look for a place together before shleping all you cr, er I mean stuff here. Go with something furnished for 6 months or so, so you can really decided what is coming and what is going from your two separate households. If you use a service like PODS, you can store your stuff right there and call to have it brought to your new digs when you two find them together.

**CComMack** · 05-26-2010, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by redpinstripes

Welcome. Good first post and good luck.

Thanks! I've been lurking occasionally here, and at PhillyBlog, for a long time.

Phillycat is correct that Craigslist for a summer sublet is a good idea. Plenty of grad and professional school types need to rent thier places for the summer.

There are also a handful of folks on the board who own rental properties and a few realtors who may be able to offer assistance (w/o seeking personal gain).

We actually know a couple people who are subletting for the summer, but given that I misspoke and neither of us is really available until early August, we're much more interested in getting a place nailed down before we roll into town. If that can't happen/is a terrible idea, we can roll with that and fall back on our previous skills, but we're ambitious.

Since you know the area a bit, is there any neighborhood that you are leaning towards? Seems like South Philadelphia would suit you both best as far as commuting. There are definitley a number of transit geeks than can help w/commute info better than I. If you have a car that is paid off (or 2) it might be worth keeping one. But, if you dont have one, buying one shouldnt be necessary.

Well, as I mentioned above, I am a transit geek, so we're good for commute info. Neither of us owns a car; she lives in Manhattan and lives and dies by her unlimited Metrocard. I might acquire a car to get me and my stuff back from NV, but would then be much more interested in selling it than keeping it.

So, our preferred search area centers on the east mooring of the South Street Bridge (which we know is closed and only reopening in late November/early December, but we're willing to eat 3-5 months of the detour), and encompasses Fitler Square and Graduate Hospital west of 19th and above Christian.

I envy you the girlfirend who is willing to move w/o a ring. Trying to do the same engineering as you with the prerequisite is tough tough tough.

Keep checking in w/ questions. Folks here enjoy helping new arrivals to the area. Once you make it, though, all bets are off.

Thanks, and we definitely will.

**CComMack** · 05-26-2010, 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

Dude.

Welcome. As far as commutes are concerned, yours are hardly "long". Totally doable. Hers might be 35 minutes max, as it is in the reverse direction. Could even be as short as 25 minutes (45 minutes to 1 hour commutes are not uncommon here).

Depending on where in South Jersey you are, yours could be even less. Much of Camden County is only 10-15 minutes from much of Center City.

Her train takes 42 minutes from Suburban and 35 minutes from UCity. My commute takes nearly two hours and involves an Atlantic City jitney.

Is her workplace near a train station?

Mercifully, yes; it's a hop, skip, and jump from Claymont.

**3rd&Brown** · 05-26-2010, 02:53 PM

Yeah. That's bad, and IMO, justification for keeping a junker parked on the street for a couple of days per week.

**CComMack** · 05-26-2010, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by 3rd&Brown

Yeah. That's bad, and IMO, justification for keeping a junker parked on the street for a couple of days per week.

The NJT AC Line actually runs at perfect times for me, so it's really not *that* bad. We'll see how it goes.

**ACG** · 05-26-2010, 05:34 PM

Originally Posted by CComMack

The NJT AC Line actually runs at perfect times for me, so it's really not *that* bad. We'll see how it goes.

Make sure to double check that, they just (or just about to) cut a lot of NJT service... would really suck if it was any route or line you two are counting on to make this work.

And as far as the Del SEPTA line goes... I had a BF there and used it a lot. The trains are few & far between (miss one and you are screwed) and often delayed, so just be prepared.

**andlikethat...** · 05-30-2010, 07:52 PM

I use to work in Claymont while living in South Philly (Pennsport)...and I would recommend Pennsport. 95 S is right there and her commute would be about 35 min, a little bit more on the way home b/c there is a bit of a bottleneck on 95N where it merges w/ 322. Your commute from Pennsport to NJ would also be easy. You should be able to find a 2BR row home in that price range, definately on the side streets (100/200 block of Fernon are great). Stay w/in Front-4th Streets, don't go 5th-8th.

With commutes to Claymont and S NJ, I think it will be a huge hassle w/out a car. Claymont is somewhat of a rundown small town, not many public transportation options from the train station.

**Sycamore** · 05-30-2010, 07:57 PM

You may be able to find a place in Queen Village or Bella Vista for that money. I would most locations in those neighborhoods to most locations in Pennsport.

**billy ross** · 05-30-2010, 08:21 PM

Originally Posted by andlikethat...

I use to work in Claymont while living in South Philly (Pennsport)...and I would recommend Pennsport. 95 S is right there and her commute would be about 35 min, a little bit more on the way home b/c there is a bit of a bottleneck on 95N where it merges w/ 322. Your commute from Pennsport to NJ would also be easy. You should be able to find a 2BR row home in that price range, definately on the side streets (100/200 block of Fernon are great). Stay w/in Front-4th Streets, don't go 5th-8th.

With commutes to Claymont and S NJ, I think it will be a huge hassle w/out a car. Claymont is somewhat of a rundown small town, not many public transportation options from the train station.

I believe that work is walkable to the train station, and that these people are minimalists, trying to survive and function without a car. It seems eminently doable, as long as they keep a book or internet with them for the times they are waiting for public transit, so that they can remain productive instead of counting the seconds.

**andlikethat...** · 05-30-2010, 08:59 PM

I understand, and I'm all for minimal use of a car (I take the bus everyday). The Claymont train station is extremely isolated. Not sure where she will be working, but there really are not many businesses nearby. Walking a mile in Claymont in the middle of Jan/Feb will get old quick.

Seems like they are trying to take the next step, commute to Claymont from Philly w/out a car will add a lot of stress to the situation, especially if the person is accustom to NYC public transportation.

**Alley** · 05-30-2010, 09:36 PM

Not sure where your gf is working that she can walk there from the Claymont Station. I agree pretty much with what "AndLikeThat" said. I lived in north Wilmington for years. Claymont by the station is not that great of an area for her to be regularly walking alone. If by chance your gf is working at the Bellevue corporate center that is too far a walk from the station if she is dressed up, alone on a winter evening, etc.