The Main Street Curse- do Main Street restaurant expansions flop more than elsewhere?

**Hal** · 07-30-2012, 11:47 PM

While looking over an old MNC newsletter, Council Crier, February 2004
had a feeling of "Deja Vu all over again"
Restaurant proposals that went nowhere.

107 Green Lane/4461 Main - Coyle's II
4402-4410 Kildares II proposal

Does it seem that Main Street does not fare well with 2nd locations, restaurant expansions, or relocations?

4311 Main Saxbys, Meze Rubb II
4324 Main - Pita Uno II
4343 Main - Saxby's II, Main Street Market expansion
4373 Main - Chabaa Thai Expansion
4400-4410 - Kildare's II, Moon II, Cervisia/Terrace Taproom II
107 Green Lane / 4461 Main - Coyles II, Loudabarber's Burgers

Is there some reason why these run into trouble?

Consider the most recent proposals obtained neighborhood support,
for 4373 Chabaa Thai expansion and 4400-4410 Main for both Moon II as well as Cervisia.
107 Green Lane's Coye's II got neighborhood support...

And then all we see is butcher paper on the windows....

Causes?

Hal

**Hal** · 07-31-2012, 12:27 AM

Originally Posted by Hal

Does it seem that Main Street does not fare well with 2nd locations, restaurant expansions, or relocations?

http://www.philadelphiaspeaks.com/fo...ew-report.html

Jinx

**mixiboi** · 07-31-2012, 12:41 AM

Overall, as that report saids, its been a bad time for restaurants for a while now.

But to focus on Main Street, it has a lot to do with people not going out and eating in new places, as this thread talks about:

http://www.philadelphiaspeaks.com/fo...et-2012-a.html

Han Dynasty is the only one to do well ,because it is different....

**Pitt** · 07-31-2012, 12:57 AM

Manayunk is entering the year 2004 full steam ahead and getting it's first gastropub. It'll be on Main Street near the antique/salvage shop on the west end of the street. Watch for it.

**BarryG** · 07-31-2012, 07:38 AM

People still go to Manayunk?

**John Goodman** · 07-31-2012, 07:45 AM

Originally Posted by BarryG

People still go to Manayunk?

drunk st joes students do...

**billy ross** · 07-31-2012, 07:51 AM

Originally Posted by BarryG

People still go to Manayunk?

Han Dynasty is worth it. There's a new frozen yogurt place my family likes too. The other places don't interest me, though, except for the Turkish place.

**BarryG** · 07-31-2012, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by billy ross

Han Dynasty is worth it. There's a new frozen yogurt place my family likes too. The other places don't interest me, though, except for the Turkish place.

There are Han Dynastys and frozen yogurt places all over the city.

**billy ross** · 07-31-2012, 08:41 AM

Originally Posted by BarryG

There are Han Dynastys and frozen yogurt places all over the city.

But none are as close to me as the ones on Main Street. I think that's the point. Main Street was a citywide destination at one point, or at least it aspired to be. Now the action has shifted to downtown, and Main Street is a destination for people who live in the surrounding area. It benefits from the suburbs' incompetence at maintaining the QOL of their downtown cores (Lancaster Pike in Ardmore, for instance). As hackneyed as MYK is, it's much more interesting than Conshohocken, which itself is a success story for MontCo. Norristown isn't a regional destination, and while KOP is, it has a corporate feel that MYK doesn't have so much. Ambler and Phoenixville are pleasant, but they're both far enough away from MYK that each has its own 'territory'. Essentially MYK is for suburbanites who want a feel of what 'the city' is like, and also for residents of the surrounding neighborhoods who want to stay close to home.

**D-man** · 07-31-2012, 12:46 PM

Sigh. I love when people from outside the neighborhood bash Manayunk, when they haven't stepped foot on Main St. in over 4 years. There are now plenty of decent places to grab a craft brew and decent food (Bourbon Blue, Tomato Bistro, Cooper's, and Lucky's to name a few). Han Dynasty was already mentioned, but Laxmi is an excellent Indian BYOB. There are also a number of successful shops that have opened in recent years. Main St Market has been hugely successful and there are several consignment/vintage shops that seem to be doing well. Spectrum Scientific and Bryn Mawr Running (who both post on this forum) have been around for several years. Nowadays, college students only make up a fraction of the patrons on Main Street, and even then you will only find them out late on Thursday, Friday and Saturday night.

Originally Posted by billy ross

Essentially MYK is for suburbanites who want a feel of what 'the city' is like, and also for residents of the surrounding neighborhoods who want to stay close to home.

Exactly. Manayunk does not need to be a destination for the entire city. There is plenty of business from nearby communities. Take a walk down Main St on any given afternoon and you will see this.

**Naveen** · 07-31-2012, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by D-man

Sigh. I love when people from outside the neighborhood bash Manayunk, when they haven't stepped foot on Main St. in over 4 years. There are now plenty of decent places to grab a craft brew and decent food (Bourbon Blue, Tomato Bistro, Cooper's, and Lucky's to name a few). Han Dynasty was already mentioned, but Laxmi is an excellent Indian BYOB. There are also a number of successful shops that have opened in recent years. Main St Market has been hugely successful and there are several consignment/vintage shops that seem to be doing well. Spectrum Scientific and Bryn Mawr Running (who both post on this forum) have been around for several years. Nowadays, college students only make up a fraction of the patrons on Main Street, and even then you will only find them out late on Thursday, Friday and Saturday night.

Exactly. Manayunk does not need to be a destination for the entire city. There is plenty of business from nearby communities. Take a walk down Main St on any given afternoon and you will see this.

I'll +1 this whole comment. I think I went to Manayunk once or twice in the 6 years I lived in South Philly. But now that I'm in East Falls it's an option again. And I'm surprised by the quality of some of the new locations on Main St. The street still has that "bro/douchebag" feel to a large extent, but the nicer spots like Cooper's definitely do not.

Main Street is not the same kind of destination it was 10 years ago, but that's a good thing IMO. As more 30-something professionals who are choosing to settle in the city move into the Northwest, I expect (hope?) the quality of Main St. dining establishments to improve.

**Debbie1125** · 07-31-2012, 01:23 PM

Originally Posted by D-man

Sigh. I love when people from outside the neighborhood bash Manayunk, when they haven't stepped foot on Main St. in over 4 years. There are now plenty of decent places to grab a craft brew and decent food (Bourbon Blue, Tomato Bistro, Cooper's, and Lucky's to name a few). Han Dynasty was already mentioned, but Laxmi is an excellent Indian BYOB. There are also a number of successful shops that have opened in recent years. Main St Market has been hugely successful and there are several consignment/vintage shops that seem to be doing well. Spectrum Scientific and Bryn Mawr Running (who both post on this forum) have been around for several years. Nowadays, college students only make up a fraction of the patrons on Main Street, and even then you will only find them out late on Thursday, Friday and Saturday night.

Exactly. Manayunk does not need to be a destination for the entire city. There is plenty of business from nearby communities. Take a walk down Main St on any given afternoon and you will see this.

+2 I like the direction that Main Street is going. There seems to be a better variety of retail. It's not just bars and a place for college students to get drunk.

I especially like the addition of the co-signment shops, The Little Apple and even though it's not on Main Street, The Spiral Bookcase.

**Hypebeast** · 07-31-2012, 02:27 PM

I would kill for ridge/midvale in East Falls to be even a tenth as nice as mainstreet in Manayunk.

**PhillyTex** · 07-31-2012, 02:34 PM

Originally Posted by Hypebeast

I would kill for ridge/midvale in East Falls to be even a tenth as nice as mainstreet in Manayunk.

I would kill for Main Street to have a parking lot even a tenth as accessable as East Falls'.

**Hal** · 07-31-2012, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by PhillyTex

I would kill for Main Street to have a parking lot even a tenth as accessable as East Falls'.

Would a pay parking lot at the old Arroyo Grille/Carmella's help?

Would a pay parking lot off Main Street, on Venice Island

you know, the partially demolished building with a pedestrian bridge that
got hit by a freight train

and now is a canvas for murals Manayunk Mural Project Moves Forward - Roxborough-Manayunk, PA Patch
with entrances at Bryn Mawr Running and Kildare's help?

Hal

**PhillyTex** · 07-31-2012, 03:53 PM

That might help, but it's not the most attractive solution. As a Roxborough resident, I'd like to have a lot available maybe 2-3 blocks up the hill from Main. Right now, I pretty much hope for a random street spot to show up before I hit Cresson. Once you get that far down, you may find parking or you may not, but chances are if it's an afternoon or evening, you're going to be stuck in all the traffic for the bridge or Main St.

It may sound petty, but when it comes right down to it, that's the kind of thing that makes me go all the way down to Rittenhouse Square instead.

**Naveen** · 07-31-2012, 04:18 PM

Originally Posted by Debbie1125

+2 I like the direction that Main Street is going. There seems to be a better variety of retail. It's not just bars and a place for college students to get drunk.

I especially like the addition of the co-signment shops, The Little Apple and even though it's not on Main Street, The Spiral Bookcase.

The retail is ok but not where it should be. I think that's actually the weakest link, with the exception of furniture stores, of which there seems to be no shortage on Main St. (not that I'm complaining; as a new homeowner it's very convenient.) I do wish there were more mid to upper-mid level clothing stores.

And I agree, it would be nice to have a decent parking lot or two. (There, I said it.)

**D-man** · 07-31-2012, 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by PhillyTex

I would kill for Main Street to have a parking lot even a tenth as accessable as East Falls'.

I don't get it. There are parking lots all over Main Street (Green Ln & Cressen, behind Chabba Thai, Cotton St. etc.) Most restaurants offer free validation and the lots are free before 3:00pm on weekdays. I never have a problem finding a spot on Main St (however, more often than not, I walk).

I do like the lot in East Falls, under the twin bridges, but I'm not sure what makes it more accessible than the ones on (or around) Main St.

**OffenseTaken** · 07-31-2012, 04:51 PM

Originally Posted by PhillyTex

That might help, but it's not the most attractive solution. As a Roxborough resident, I'd like to have a lot available maybe 2-3 blocks up the hill from Main. Right now, I pretty much hope for a random street spot to show up before I hit Cresson. Once you get that far down, you may find parking or you may not, but chances are if it's an afternoon or evening, you're going to be stuck in all the traffic for the bridge or Main St.

It may sound petty, but when it comes right down to it, that's the kind of thing that makes me go all the way down to Rittenhouse Square instead.

If Manayunk had to clear away 100 square feet of land for every occasional visitor and pave it over, even for those coming in from as near as Roxborough, then it wouldn't be our beloved Manayunk anymore. In fact, it would be Roxborough.

The only reason why you presumably find more parking around Rittenhouse is all the multi-level garages. Until Manayunk builds one of those on one of the duller blocks of Main and the R6 starts to run more often than God-knows-when, parking is just always going to be at a premium in the neighborhood.

**Hal** · 07-31-2012, 04:52 PM

Originally Posted by PhillyTex

Originally Posted by Hal

Would a pay parking lot off Main Street, on Venice Island
with entrances at Bryn Mawr Running and Kildare's help?

That might help, but it's not the most attractive solution.
As a Roxborough resident, I'd like to have a lot available maybe 2-3 blocks up the hill from Main.

Confused!? That makes no sense.

A lot on Venice Island from Cotton to Carson (Waterford)
or Green Lane to Leverington (Neducsin)
would be 1/2 block from Main Street.

But, you don't like that idea, because you want to park FURTHER away
and then walk 200% to 300% further?
Why?

Hal