Ridge & Midvale Pedestrian Island

**mixiboi** · 07-04-2012, 02:10 PM

Well while they finish that.. the other one is finish..not as pretty with the sign, but hey, at least I know where I am now when I go by it:

**mm230** · 07-04-2012, 02:36 PM

I hope the East Falls sign is nicer than that.

**Malloy** · 07-04-2012, 02:38 PM

LOL I took a pic of that sign the other to post here...but I forgot to post it. That sign is terrible, just like the one at the top of the hill.

**waterman** · 07-05-2012, 10:18 PM

Why does it take so long to build a traffic island? I think Rouse built One Liberty in less time than these 2 islands.

**friendlynerd** · 07-06-2012, 08:25 AM

Originally Posted by waterman

Why does it take so long to build a traffic island? I think Rouse built One Liberty in less time than these 2 islands.

Seriously, if I hired a contractor this slow I would be shopping for a new contractor.

**billy ross** · 07-06-2012, 09:03 AM

Originally Posted by waterman

Why does it take so long to build a traffic island? I think Rouse built One Liberty in less time than these 2 islands.

Maybe the contractor is the same one the Water Department uses on its never-ending Fox Street jobs?

I seem to remember you being an apologist for the water department acting like they own Fox Street in the same way that they wiped Indian Queen Lane off the map (Indian Queen Lane used to go through to the Queen Lane Station before the water department ruined a conveinient pedestrian right-of-way - that's why Indian Queen Lane and Queen Lane are so similarly named - they used to be the same street).

**Naveen** · 07-06-2012, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by waterman

Why does it take so long to build a traffic island?

I've wondered this too.

**waterman** · 07-06-2012, 03:00 PM

[QUOTE]I seem to remember you being an apologist for the water department acting like they own Fox Street in the same way that they wiped Indian Queen Lane off the map (Indian Queen Lane used to go through to the Queen Lane Station before the water department ruined a conveinient pedestrian right-of-way - that's why Indian Queen Lane and Queen Lane are so similarly named - they used to be the same street)./QUOTE]

Not an apologist, just giving explanation re what was going on with the new pumping station if I remember. That was a tad bit more complex than the traffic island. A couple of points about the Queen Lane facility- you can build a plant anywhere but, there can be an operational and cost advantage in building these facilities on high ground, if there's a water source reasonably near by. Belmont, Queen Lane, Upper Roxborough (plant closed in 1960s; replaced by storage) are on high ground. Baxter (State & Linden) is not on high ground, so relies strictly on pumping of treated water. Belmont and Queen Lane have gravity districts as well as pumped districts. So, the City chose the Queen Lane site for their plant and had to sacrifice Indian Queen Lane. Where should our noble forefathers have put it? Maybe where our houses are would have worked, but that would have changed history. I would have lost my best neighbor and vice versa.
Yes, Fox St is problematic. Because the water plant is on both sides, there's a ton of infrastructure crossing back and forth under the street. If I were designing it today, I'd probably have a huge underground vault running the full length, kind of like the Henry Ave bridge or Disney World, so there could be operational activity which doesn't impact the street above. Speculation. High cost.....

**the mule** · 07-06-2012, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by Malloy

LOL I took a pic of that sign the other to post here...but I forgot to post it. That sign is terrible, just like the one at the top of the hill.

Indeed. It makes me feel like the sign should have a "sponsored by TD Bank" subtitle to it instead of the "Gateway to Roxborough"

**mixiboi** · 07-06-2012, 03:42 PM

Originally Posted by the mule

Indeed. It makes me feel like the sign should have a "sponsored by TD Bank" subtitle to it instead of the "Gateway to Roxborough"

Well TD did fund them....If I remind you:

**the mule** · 07-07-2012, 03:38 AM

Originally Posted by mixiboi

Well TD did fund them....If I remind you:

Well my point was that the Wissahickon sign is a slightly upgraded copy of the sign at TD, which I assume was funded by TD since it's on their property. However, I'm almost certain the Wissahickon sign was funded by the ReStore Philadelphia Corridors grant the RDC received for the Ridge Ave. revitalization.

http://www.roxborough.us/ridgeMasterPlan.pdf

**mixiboi** · 07-07-2012, 11:06 AM

Yeah, I was just joking, Im sure the same company mad e the sign tho...Where as East Fall sign is being made by someone else....

**HammRadio** · 07-10-2012, 01:41 PM

Saw this thread and thought I'd post about the unfinished island... On Saturday night I was driving past Ridge on Midvale toward Kelly and a car making a left to turn on to Midvale enters the Westbound lane right into oncoming traffic (ME!!!) I lay on my horn... as they wave apologetically... and right behind them? another car just following on through!!!!

I guess the island with its yellow tape and orange cones looked like was the best way to turn... but geesh.

Anyone else see traffic problems like that here??? I dont' make that left anymore onto Midvale, instead taking the Ridge Ave South exit from 76.

**redpinstripes** · 07-10-2012, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by HammRadio

Saw this thread and thought I'd post about the unfinished island... On Saturday night I was driving past Ridge on Midvale toward Kelly and a car making a left to turn on to Midvale enters the Westbound lane right into oncoming traffic (ME!!!) I lay on my horn... as they wave apologetically... and right behind them? another car just following on through!!!!

I guess the island with its yellow tape and orange cones looked like was the best way to turn... but geesh.

Anyone else see traffic problems like that here??? I dont' make that left anymore onto Midvale, instead taking the Ridge Ave South exit from 76.

I saw someone do the same thing Sunday afternoon.

**The Count** · 07-10-2012, 02:24 PM

Originally Posted by HammRadio

Saw this thread and thought I'd post about the unfinished island... On Saturday night I was driving past Ridge on Midvale toward Kelly and a car making a left to turn on to Midvale enters the Westbound lane right into oncoming traffic (ME!!!) I lay on my horn... as they wave apologetically... and right behind them? another car just following on through!!!!

I guess the island with its yellow tape and orange cones looked like was the best way to turn... but geesh.

Anyone else see traffic problems like that here??? I dont' make that left anymore onto Midvale, instead taking the Ridge Ave South exit from 76.

I've lived in EF for 9 years and I've twice almost made this mistake. There is something visually confusing.

My concern is that there will be enough collisions that they will put up a bunch of "Wrong Way" and "Do Not Enter" signs that it will effectively wind up blocking the view of the sign that says East Falls, (which was the hole point of the island in the first place).

**Hypebeast** · 07-10-2012, 02:59 PM

Maybe a big arrow on the ground?

**Juntonian** · 07-10-2012, 04:54 PM

Originally Posted by The Count

I've lived in EF for 9 years and I've twice almost made this mistake. There is something visually confusing.

My concern is that there will be enough collisions that they will put up a bunch of "Wrong Way" and "Do Not Enter" signs that it will effectively wind up blocking the view of the sign that says East Falls, (which was the hole point of the island in the first place).

Agreed. Personally, I'm disappointed that the present signs (warning of a traffic island) were installed. It may be the case that these are mandated, but they still function to obstruct the view of the river and sign and, in my opinion, detract from the overall appearance of the island. The thing is so small that they seem entirely out of proportion and a bit of overkill. I think arrow signs installed closer to the ground would have been the better aesthetic choice. This being said, they're still apparently insufficient, and if the signage was to increase due to driver confusion, I think the entire thing would become quite unattractive.

**HammRadio** · 07-10-2012, 10:59 PM

Decided to make that left myself today... and noticed on the South Side of the island there's a small square gray sign that says... Enter Here....

will try and take a pic of it.... Not sure if the engineers really thought it out....

A directional YELLOW oval line would help.. .but since there's a directional center white line for the left turn from Midvale might be confusing... will have to keep an eye on it...

**Gina Snyder** · 07-11-2012, 10:55 AM

We are the Streets Dept and are already watching this. There is a temporary sign there at the front. Some confusion may be due to the construction barrels and to the new pattern itself. When everything is completed, we will continue to monitor it to make sure it is safe and attractive. Some adjustment with lines or signs may be appropriate.

These comments are greatly appreciated.

**redpinstripes** · 07-11-2012, 12:20 PM

Originally Posted by Gina Snyder

We are the Streets Dept and are already watching this. There is a temporary sign there at the front. Some confusion may be due to the construction barrels and to the new pattern itself. When everything is completed, we will continue to monitor it to make sure it is safe and attractive. Some adjustment with lines or signs may be appropriate.

These comments are greatly appreciated.

I dont think it is the construction barrels. I took a left here yesterday afternoon and it was almost impossible to see that there was a traffic lane on the other side of the island because it is obscured by the height of the curbing.

I saw the "enter here" sign and the "do not enter sign" on the opposite corner, but I do not think they would have given me adequate direction had I not known the intersection.