Is It Time for Newbies to Takeover City Hall?

[ArcticSplash]

What Will It Take for New Philadelphians to Clean Up City Hall? | Philadelphia Magazine Articles

[Giavella Water]

What Will It Take for New Philadelphians to Clean Up City Hall? | Philadelphia Magazine Articles

It will have to be done. Someone sooner or later will step up to the plate who is a newbie and doesn't mind wallowing in the mud. I hope it's soon.

[Hospitalitygirl]

God I hope so!

[MetalDeth81]

Not anymore. “These people, most of them don’t even drive,” DiCicco says of the new Philadelphians. “And if they get tickets, they just pay them.” He finds this incomprehensible. The amazing thing is, DiCicco was more sensitive to the priorities of new Philadelphians than perhaps anyone else in City Council. He proposed the 10-year property tax abatement, which helped enable the condo boom. He resisted the casinos. And still, he doesn’t seem to get them.

I wonder if the author tried to at least help clue DiCicco in a bit.

[thegreattwizz]

The issue is getting a newbie actually elected. The establishment has such a firm grip on it, and the bankroll to keep their cronies in. I, for one, would happily take the pay cut and additional stress/workload to go to council and make a difference. Where to find the support is another question......

[five apples]

I am friends with lots of newbies, most of them don't vote in the local elections frequently. They talk and talk about Obama, Romney and Corbett but don't know who their City Council Person is and most wouldn't be able to tell you how at an large is elected. They don't get it, they bitch, but they don't participate. So you need them to understand that they have to get involved or the same old crap will go on until they do.

[newphil]

Bill Green is a good start and he isn't a newbie.

[thoth]

I am friends with lots of newbies, most of them don't vote in the local elections frequently. They talk and talk about Obama, Romney and Corbett but don't know who their City Council Person is and most wouldn't be able to tell you how at an large is elected. They don't get it, they bitch, but they don't participate. So you need them to understand that they have to get involved or the same old crap will go on until they do.

This has been my experience as well.

[five apples]

Bill Green is a good start and he isn't a newbie.

I honestly don't know what to make of the guy. The money behind certainly isn't friendly to reform. But I think he at least gets it, that his chance of becoming Mayor is to be like Nutter was in Council and say the right things that appeal to your reformer minded Philadelphians, new or old. He got some nice business tax bills passed and seems to at least have a bit of a brain. But I still don't really trust him.

[DCnPhilly]

I am friends with lots of newbies, most of them don't vote in the local elections frequently. They talk and talk about Obama, Romney and Corbett but don't know who their City Council Person is and most wouldn't be able to tell you how at an large is elected. They don't get it, they bitch, but they don't participate. So you need them to understand that they have to get involved or the same old crap will go on until they do.

I've encountered this, but I think a lot of it comes from a frustration with the bureaucratic mess that keeps these old Philadelphians in office. New Philadelphians and City Hall speak two different languages, and instead of trying to work together they just ignore each other. The same reason the old Philadelphians in City Hall fail to understand the new Philadelphians is the exact same reason new Philadelphians fail to engage in local politics.

That's no excuse but it's understandable.

[DCnPhilly]

After rereading the article, it seems like the new Philadelphians' reluctance to engage in local politics might be as indicative of an American generation as it is the simple fact that they're new to the city. He doesn't discuss immigrants because they are actively engaged in politics, somewhat successfully, and the only person he interviewed that seemed to truly go up against any local machine is from Dublin.

The rest are involved in neighborhood organizations and non-profits, and while those organizations are involved with politicians, they aren't the best examples of the democratic process. It's easy to argue your case from the comfort of a blog, a community meeting, or a non-profit, but you have little to lose. Is this what happens when a generation with a shelf full of "participation trophies" enters the real world?

A generation of hipsters and yuppies raised in suburban high schools that have never experienced failure are naturally reluctant to go up against career politicians, to be thrust into the local media and answer to local politicians instead of their peers, and, even if they manage to win, forced to manage an office steeped in a century of corruption, responsible for a fraction of the population that will never think you're doing enough.

Politics puts you in a tough position that requires motivation and strong character, whether you're a good person or not, and new Philadelphians are largely part of a generation of Americans that never really had to try. It's a lot easier to stand up and speak at a community meeting or work with non-profits than it is to deal with the crushing reality that most of your friends didn't bother to vote for you.

Not that these organizations and watchdogs haven't served a vital part in the revitalization of our city, but City Hall doesn't stand a chance of changing until someone in this growing demographic of passive idealists is willing to risk public humiliation, irrational criticism, and failure on behalf of their peers.

[phillycat]

I agree, I think it is generational rather than something specific about "new Philadelphians." We simply did not grow up with thinking about our local government - in the suburbs especially, who knows who your city councilperson is? Who knows who fills the potholes?

I think there also hasn't been a single issue for the NPs to join forces on - not everyone cares about bike lanes and most of the dumb shady crap just flies under the radar of NPs. In addition, since most of them are of your general college-educated liberal bent, if they do want to get involved in Philly politics they are really confused by the complex racial politics of the place, and it's pretty easy to intimidate them or make them uncomfortable in that way.

OTOH, they would be pretty easy to organize if they had one single issue to coalesce around - it's not that big a town, and everyone is closely linked online if not in the real world.

Prediction: if AVI slams the "NP" districts all out of proportion, and the City Council figures out a way to exempt "long-term residents" from the same tax increases, you'll see the NP's coalesce pretty damn quick. Might even lead to serious change.

Just remember, NYC was called "the ungovernable city" in the 70s. Things change.

[BarryG]

After rereading the article, it seems like the new Philadelphians' reluctance to engage in local politics might be as indicative of an American generation as it is the simple fact that they're new to the city. He doesn't discuss immigrants because they are actively engaged in politics, somewhat successfully, and the only person he interviewed that seemed to truly go up against any local machine is from Dublin.

The rest are involved in neighborhood organizations and non-profits, and while those organizations are involved with politicians, they aren't the best examples of the democratic process. It's easy to argue your case from the comfort of a blog, a community meeting, or a non-profit, but you have little to lose. Is this what happens when a generation with a shelf full of "participation trophies" enters the real world?

A generation of hipsters and yuppies raised in suburban high schools that have never experienced failure are naturally reluctant to go up against career politicians, to be thrust into the local media and answer to local politicians instead of their peers, and, even if they manage to win, forced to manage an office steeped in a century of corruption, responsible for a fraction of the population that will never think you're doing enough.

Politics puts you in a tough position that requires motivation and strong character, whether you're a good person or not, and new Philadelphians are largely part of a generation of Americans that never really had to try. It's a lot easier to stand up and speak at a community meeting or work with non-profits than it is to deal with the crushing reality that most of your friends didn't bother to vote for you.

Not that these organizations and watchdogs haven't served a vital part in the revitalization of our city, but City Hall doesn't stand a chance of changing until someone in this growing demographic of passive idealists is willing to risk public humiliation, irrational criticism, and failure on behalf of their peers.

I don't disagree wit this but people all over the country talk about Obama, Romney and their governors while often not holding strong opinions about their legislators at any level. I would wager that while many of the "New Philadelphians" don't know who their councilperson is, they all know who the mayor is and probably have some opinion of him. People in general put too much emphasis on the executive and not enough on the legislative. That is bad everywhere but especially so with the way government works in Phila.

[thoth]

Please. Turning this into a generational rant is absurd. Maybe you haven't noticed that were a couple generations deep in "new Philadelphians" now, and it's not like 30/40/50-somethings have done a spectacular job of rallying against the machine.

Calling younger people a generation that "doesn't know failure" is just some hobby horse to discredit everyone that came after you like "i walked 20 miles in the snow to..." Not to mention that it's blatantly untrue. You do realize that most 20-somethings started their careers with a crippled job and RE market, right? That concepts like good-paying blue collar jobs and pensions essentially don't exist for young people, right? This a generation that started their adult lives with failure and I don't know about you, but most of the young people I know aren't waiting in breadlines, they're working. And when it comes to local politics they seem about as politically engaged as the middle-aged people in Northwest that let DRM get reelected multiple times or the Center City dwellers that blindly voted in "reformers" like Babette Josephs 30 years ago.

[Gladys]

this

[concourse]

Isn't Jeff Hornstein pretty new Philadelphia? He ran and lost so I guess he knows what failure's like.

[BarryG]

Isn't Jeff Hornstein pretty new Philadelphia? He ran and lost so I guess he knows what failure's like.

Hornstein is a union hack, last thing we need in City Hall right now.

[Fecteau03]

Regardless of the issues, I think the only way you're going to get 'new blood', whether transplants or just younger Philadelphians in general to win a local election is by taking another significant swipe at the ward structure.

People can be cycnical about 311, but one intent was to stop the charade where political parties tricked people into thinking that the party was delivering city services.

The weaker the ward system is, the more chance there is for someone other than the entrenched party elite to come out of a primary, or an independent to make a viable run for office.

The question is, how do you further weaken the wards?

[thoth]

Regardless of the issues, I think the only way you're going to get 'new blood', whether transplants or just younger Philadelphians in general to win a local election is by taking another significant swipe at the ward structure.

People can be cycnical about 311, but one intent was to stop the charade where political parties tricked people into thinking that the party was delivering city services.

The weaker the ward system is, the more chance there is for someone other than the entrenched party elite to come out of a primary, or an independent to make a viable run for office.

The question is, how do you further weaken the wards?

This is where you actually need newcomers to run for some of these open/weak ward slots, imo. it's a crappy job. The Rs made some progress, but we saw how that went.

Honestly, it might be better not to feed the system and simply not get involved. If you look at many council races in Philly, they're decided by a few thousand votes. Creating an independent vote getting operation would mimic the functions of the wards without having to battle ones way through entrenched party figures.

[Naveen]

In regards to the question posed by the subject of this thread, "Is it time for newbies to take over City Hall?", I'd like to see "newbies" get more involved in government first. Figure out how to govern -- I don't think you can effectively reform if you haven't tried to govern.

As to the generational issue posed in this discussion, I do think it is generational but not in the way posited by DCnPhilly. I think that "old Philadelphia" is to a large extent just that -- old. Many of these people are slowly dying off and are not being replaced. They had less children than their parents did, and many of those children have moved to the inner suburbs. Those that do stay in the city are more likely than their parents to be college-educated and less provincial. (This isn't to say that there aren't people in the same mold -- just that they are far less in number than before.)

One thing I found interesting in the Philly Mag article was the view towards Latino and Asian immigrants to the city. Is the perception of the author (perhaps shared by others) that these constituencies represent the same style of politics as "white ethnics" and African-Americans? And therefore, that Latinos and Asians won't bring any reform to City Hall, but will simply join the existing system?