Nutter and Made in America

**nickster** · 09-02-2012, 09:19 AM

Am I the only person pi$$ed that Nutter has tap danced around informing us as to what this event is costing the city/taxpayers? It shouldn't be costing us anything if it is a paid ticket event, IMO.

The front page of the Inquirer this morning states that nearly 40,000 were in attendance yesterday. I thought it was projected to be 50,000 yesterday and 50,000 today? If the Inquirer is correct, this means that more than 10,000 tickets were not sold for yesterday's event.

This is just another reason why we should not re-elect any mayor to a second term moving forward. One four year term and that's it. Done. Bye bye. Nutter has done nothing but continue to screw the taxpayers with the temporary tax increase that didn't go away as promised, more R/E tax increases and, of course, my favorite, how he just gave all his head honchos nice fat pay increases! They are already making six figure salaries, no? Yet he begrudges the firefighters a pay increase ordered by binding arbitration. Also, if I'm not mistaken, city workers haven't gotten a pay increase for four years now. Since day one of his second term, Nutter has thumbed his nose at the taxpayers and city workers of this city.

We need to learn our lesson from all this BS and not allow any mayor to serve more than one term in the future.

**The Count** · 09-02-2012, 09:30 AM

Originally Posted by nickster

Am I the only person pi$$ed that Nutter has tap danced around informing us as to what this event is costing the city/taxpayers? It shouldn't be costing us anything if it is a paid ticket event, IMO.

The front page of the Inquirer this morning states that nearly 40,000 were in attendance yesterday. I thought it was projected to be 50,000 yesterday and 50,000 today? If the Inquirer is correct, this means that more than 10,000 tickets were not sold for yesterday's event.

This is just another reason why we should not re-elect any mayor to a second term moving forward. One four year term and that's it. Done. Bye bye. Nutter has done nothing but continue to screw the taxpayers with the temporary tax increase that didn't go away as promised, more R/E tax increases and, of course, my favorite, how he just gave all his head honchos nice fat pay increases! They are already making six figure salaries, no? Yet he begrudges the firefighters a pay increase ordered by binding arbitration. Also, if I'm not mistaken, city workers haven't gotten a pay increase for four years now. Since day one of his second term, Nutter has thumbed his nose at the taxpayers and city workers of this city.

We need to learn our lesson from all this BS and not allow any mayor to serve more than one term in the future.

This post is so absurd I don't know where to begin.

1) I'm sure all numbers/estimates are inflated, they always are with these things. Nevertheless it's likely to that the overall economic benefits will be net positive for the city when you count for shopping, restaurants, and hotel bookings.

2) I don't see how a 1-term system solves anyhing, probably makes it worse.

3) I work in private sector and haven't gotten a raise in 4 years either, it's called a recession. Many city workers don't do jack anyway so if anything they should be psyched that the bottom 30% haven't been fired.

2)

**DocAwesome** · 09-02-2012, 09:48 AM

There was hoping for 50k a day. If you have been paying attention you would know that sales, while good, were not all there. Feel free to blame Nutter for that if you want, you will be in limited company

The income from tickets were already noted to be to defray costs of the logistics and setup, with a chunk going to the United Way. The benefit to Philly was ancillary/indirect (hotels, bars, restaurants and stores, not to mention a ****ton of cops were paid overtime yesterday to watch a concert - I would in fact be curious as to if those dollars started in Philly), as well as intangible (advertising, both for the show and for Philadelphia).

I don't know where to start with the wages part. I'll let you have it.

If you want to be pissed and be honest about it instead how about the fact that Nutter strongarmed this festival for what could appear to be a way to garner favor with the DNC via an Obama prerecorded appearance. He is surely wanting to make a national play, so I'd understand that anger at least.

**nickster** · 09-02-2012, 09:50 AM

So then if all numbers/estimates are inflated, then maybe there was only 30,000 people in attendance yesterday and 20,000 unsold tickets.

I doubt the majority of people are coming in from out of town for this event so that doesn't really impact hotel bookings. And shopping and dining, once ticketholders are in the area, they can't leave and get back in. No re-entry. So any shopping and dining they are doing is inside the closed off concert area.

I know many city workers who are hard working, dedicated employees. So you think it's o.k. for Nutter to give his head honchos big fat pay increases when they are already making six figure salaries and there is nothing for other city workers, including firefighters, for four years now? Seems very unfair to me.

One term for a mayor will eliminate 4 years of lame duck, extra screwing of the taxpayers by said mayor.

**Hospitalitygirl** · 09-02-2012, 10:05 AM

Originally Posted by nickster

One term for a mayor will eliminate 4 years of lame duck, extra screwing of the taxpayers by said mayor.

\

Term limits mean that politicians don't have to keep "auditioning" for their jobs and will instead do whatever they want, thereby insuring that they do nothing more than kick problems down the road for the next schmuck to deal with or ignore. Better to have a more attuned populace who has some idea of what's going on and become more invested in voting and making better choices.

**nickster** · 09-02-2012, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Hospitalitygirl

\

Term limits mean that politicians don't have to keep "auditioning" for their jobs and will instead do whatever they want, thereby insuring that they do nothing more than kick problems down the road for the next schmuck to deal with or ignore.

So I guess we are screwed either way.

**raider.adam** · 09-02-2012, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by DocAwesome

The income from tickets were already noted to be to defray costs of the logistics and setup, with a chunk going to the United Way. The benefit to Philly was ancillary/indirect (hotels, bars, restaurants and stores, not to mention a ****ton of cops were paid overtime yesterday to watch a concert - I would in fact be curious as to if those dollars started in Philly), as well as intangible (advertising, both for the show and for Philadelphia).

I am not a big fan of the defense that the City should pay for services for a paid event because they may make money on other taxes. I understand part of the logic when talking about free events like holiday parades (not so much ethnic parades).

**Gladys** · 09-02-2012, 10:49 AM

Originally Posted by The Count

This post is so absurd I don't know where to begin.

Thank you - that says it all.

**Cya** · 09-02-2012, 11:22 AM

FOP says city slashed number of Parkway cops

FOP vice president John McGrody said numerous officers who were scheduled to work this weekend were instead told late Friday or early Saturday that they shouldn’t show up for their shifts.
Specific figures weren’t immediately available, but McGrody said the number of officers who were told not to work the detail was “significant.”

“From what we’re hearing from our members, in certain spots where three or four cops were supposed to [monitoring] an area, there’s now only one,” McGrody said

Well, here's a cost savings, I guess.
Yeah, if I was a cop and on the schedule to work this concert, and I was told at the last minute not to show up for my shift of overtime, I'd be p*ssed. I'm sure cops cancelled family plans, etc.

Maybe City Hall got scared and forced Budwiser to pay for more private security staffing?
Nutter's lucky nothing happened- or he would have been raked over the coals for that decision.

**nickster** · 09-02-2012, 11:41 AM

What about all the people who are avoiding the last days of the Arcadia Exhibit at the Philadelphia Museum Art? I would think that would offset much of the spending as a result of Made in America.

The main point is Nutter not informing the public what it is costing us. We have a right to know. If he is keeping quiet about it and avoiding the entire issue of cost, I guess we pretty much can assume it's costing the city taxpayers a lot of money that we don't have.

**eldondre** · 09-02-2012, 11:49 AM

Originally Posted by nickster

So then if all numbers/estimates are inflated, then maybe there was only 30,000 people in attendance yesterday and 20,000 unsold tickets.

I doubt the majority of people are coming in from out of town for this event so that doesn't really impact hotel bookings. And shopping and dining, once ticketholders are in the area, they can't leave and get back in. No re-entry. So any shopping and dining they are doing is inside the closed off concert area.

I know many city workers who are hard working, dedicated employees. So you think it's o.k. for Nutter to give his head honchos big fat pay increases when they are already making six figure salaries and there is nothing for other city workers, including firefighters, for four years now? Seems very unfair to me.

One term for a mayor will eliminate 4 years of lame duck, extra screwing of the taxpayers by said mayor.

actually most indications are that there was majority in from out of town with all hotels.booked up. Maybe ill try to secure a ticket to Arcadia tomorrow since you say its open. I do want to go. Just days ago people were hyperventilating about the traffic mess but its been.rather muted.

**Hospitalitygirl** · 09-02-2012, 11:52 AM

Originally Posted by nickster

What about all the people who are avoiding the last days of the Arcadia Exhibit at the Philadelphia Museum Art? I would think that would offset much of the spending as a result of Made in America.

The main point is Nutter not informing the public what it is costing us. We have a right to know. If he is keeping quiet about it and avoiding the entire issue of cost, I guess we pretty much can assume it's costing the city taxpayers a lot of money that we don't have.

You had so many points it was tough to tell which was the "main point".

Yes, we as citizens should have been appraised of costs v. benefits, and not his lame dismissals about worry over costs. In case you don't know, many people have questioned, including, most notably, Brett Mandel. But City Council and others have remained mute on the point of costs. If people would stop acting as though these politicians we elect are going to be there (with the exception of the mayor) until they're taken out in toe tags; ask the questions and demand answers, and at election time look to the other offerings available--including...horror of horrors changing registrations and voting across party lines, we'll be stuck with the SOS.

**BarryG** · 09-02-2012, 12:04 PM

Originally Posted by Hospitalitygirl

You had so many points it was tough to tell which was the "main point".

Yes, we as citizens should have been appraised of costs v. benefits, and not his lame dismissals about worry over costs. In case you don't know, many people have questioned, including, most notably, Brett Mandel. But City Council and others have remained mute on the point of costs. If people would stop acting as though these politicians we elect are going to be there (with the exception of the mayor) until they're taken out in toe tags; ask the questions and demand answers, and at election time look to the other offerings available--including...horror of horrors changing registrations and voting across party lines, we'll be stuck with the SOS.

If this becomes an annual event on the same or bigger scale, the city paying for some police OT and safety stuff is going to be worth it. Assuming today goes as well yesterday, I do hope nutter recaps the economic impact and city costs.

**eldondre** · 09-02-2012, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by BarryG

If this becomes an annual event on the same or bigger scale, the city paying for some police OT and safety stuff is going to be worth it. Assuming today goes as well yesterday, I do hope nutter recaps the economic impact and city costs.

the only real complaint I have is they way overprepared and told people to stay away. The fact is even the estimated crowds were way less than the one night fourth of July free concert. Given that septa added service he should have encouraged everyone to take septa that could. That said not much traffic

**BarryG** · 09-02-2012, 12:10 PM

Originally Posted by eldondre

the only real complaint I have is they way overprepared and told people to stay away. The fact is even the estimated crowds were way less than the one night fourth of July free concert. Given that septa added service he should have encouraged everyone to take septa that could. That said not much traffic

I was on the parkway around concert start time yesterday and it looked to me like most people were walking. Inky interviewed a lot of people from out of town, they all would have taken care of their cars beforehand. It's less than 10% the size of the Welcome America July 4th concert and less people than a sold out Phillies game, and way less people drove to this than do to either of those events. People getting their panties in a bunch over nothing.

The city did overprepare and I guess that's why police were cut at the last minute. Hopefully the dumbass residents of this city realize now that a bunch of 20-35 year olds who go to shows like this are not troublemakers.

From the concert website:
"Philadelphia is one of the best walking cities in the country. The Budweiser Made in America festival site is just a short walk from downtown Philadelphia (Center City) and 30th St Station, which makes it easily one of the most manageable festival experiences in the country.

Aside from walking, Philadelphia's excellent transit system is the best way to get around town. SEPTA is the most comprehensive bus/subway/commuter-rail system in the United States. SEPTA's vast network of bus, subway, and trolley commuter services will get you anywhere you need to go — or at least very close. Find and map your route at www.septa.org"

They had bike parking arrangement too.

**Giavella Water** · 09-02-2012, 01:02 PM

It's not the paying concert goers that ar the trouble, it's the gangs of kids that can show up outside the venue and rampage.
It's good the cops had a show of force in that that can deter a lot of wolf packs from showing up.

**nickster** · 09-02-2012, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by BarryG

If this becomes an annual event on the same or bigger scale, the city paying for some police OT and safety stuff is going to be worth it. Assuming today goes as well yesterday, I do hope nutter recaps the economic impact and city costs.

How will we ever know if it's worth it if we are kept in the dark about the costs to taxpayers? At this point, simply hoping that Nutter "recaps the economic impact and city costs" is foolishly impractical.

**BarryG** · 09-02-2012, 01:50 PM

Originally Posted by nickster

How will we ever know if it's worth it if we are kept in the dark about the costs to taxpayers? At this point, simply hoping that Nutter "recaps the economic impact and city costs" is foolishly impractical.

Actually I just saw that the city is planning on having data in a few weeks, see here: BUDWEISER MADE IN AMERICA FESTIVAL ALREADY BENEFITTING CITY OF PHILADELPHIA ECONOMY « City of Philadelphia's News & Alerts

But considering that this already happened, I don't see how wanting a recap is "foolishly impractical."

nickster, do you also demand full accounting of the city's costs for Welcome America, the weeklong event culminating in a concert that draws over 10x the number of people to the Parkway, or the city's subsidy for the Phlash tourist bus?

Furthermore, if this event is successful and wants to return to Phila, it is worth giving it a couple years to get the financial bearings straight, even if they aren't fantastic in year one.

**eldondre** · 09-02-2012, 02:52 PM

Barry-exactly what would have happened if the bank had been built near 30th. Its much easier to get people to use transit when the venue is near transit.

**Cya** · 09-02-2012, 03:03 PM

Originally Posted by nickster

How will we ever know if it's worth it if we are kept in the dark about the costs to taxpayers? At this point, simply hoping that Nutter "recaps the economic impact and city costs" is foolishly impractical.

I'll be glad when it's all over and we don't see any violence on the news from it. So far, so good.