When is a custom built storm door necessary?

[phillysleuth]

I've been told by various contractor types who measured my current door opening that I have a very odd sized opening. There definitely aren't doors close to these dimensions at the big box stores, and the special order sizes don't match either. So, I'm told, it needs to be a custom door. The dimensions, as last measured by a not very competent "little boy" who came out to do an estimate on the project without bringing brochures or knowing how to explain what made his companies lowest cost door $1100, are roughly 33 3/4 x 82 7/8. This is for a row house in Fairmount. I'm not looking for top of the line, but something well built so I don't end up with another storm door that rots from the inside in 9 years, as mine has.

A friend says you can reframe the door opening to accomodate a standard door, but I have doubts. There's only so much height and width to play with and you then end up paying for whatever tricks have to be played with framing, so is it worth it? Any door companies or manufacturers that you'd recommend for what I consider a small, pretty easy job?

[paul100]

The size you listed can be special ordered from Home depot. here is a link to the sizes. http://www.stormdoors.com/pdf/Measur...structions.pdf

[Reader]

We had a similar situation and did the special order from Home Depot. Paid the extra money for additional installation to build out a new frame. That was the beginning of October. I'm still fighting with Home Depot over the extremely poor way it was installed. For example, there was a gap at the base of the door that they filled by attaching a rod to the floor with putty. A round rod, that stuck up about 1/2 an inch higher than the floor and hung off the back of the top step. The door also only opens about 3/4 of the way and they didn't finish the framing on the new piece.
Apparently Home Depot sub contract this stuff and I've been going back and forth between Home Depot and the contracting company. At last count I've been told at least 3 people have been fired (don't know if I believe this), and I've had appointments lost, canceled and rescheduled more times than I can count. I've also been told parts have been lost, stolen, back ordered, re-ordered, etc. I have an appointment with the owner of the contracting company to "look" at the door this week, which is actually the second time this was supposed to happen. He didn't come the last time. This is their last shot before I contact the Better Business Bureau and go through my credit card company to get a refund. Short story - go with an actual contractor, not Home Depot.

[enyo]

I've been told by various contractor types who measured my current door opening that I have a very odd sized opening. There definitely aren't doors close to these dimensions at the big box stores, and the special order sizes don't match either. So, I'm told, it needs to be a custom door. The dimensions, as last measured by a not very competent "little boy" who came out to do an estimate on the project without bringing brochures or knowing how to explain what made his companies lowest cost door $1100, are roughly 33 3/4 x 82 7/8. This is for a row house in Fairmount. I'm not looking for top of the line, but something well built so I don't end up with another storm door that rots from the inside in 9 years, as mine has.

A friend says you can reframe the door opening to accomodate a standard door, but I have doubts. There's only so much height and width to play with and you then end up paying for whatever tricks have to be played with framing, so is it worth it? Any door companies or manufacturers that you'd recommend for what I consider a small, pretty easy job?

You might want to get a second quote. Also, is this a masonry opening or wood framed? I would get their opinions on packing the frame out or enlarging it. They might be able to pry a piece of trim loose on all the sides to see what framing is hidden by the trim.
If you're lucky and its already packed out you might be able to remove a few 2x framing members and pack it out with 1x or plywood to fit a 36" door. A home depot door + a Carpenter might come in cheaper than the original quote.

[phillysleuth]

The size you listed can be special ordered from Home depot. here is a link to the sizes. http://www.stormdoors.com/pdf/Measur...structions.pdf

With the height of 82+ inches, it still looks like it would have to be a custom order, not special. I don't trust my ability to get the right measurements, and I definitely don't trust Home Depot to know anything or their installers, since I've heard nothing but bad reports, so I've got a company who makes their own doors and is highly rated on Angies List to come for an estimate tomorrow. I'm so tired of spending time on such a small job and dealing with contractors. There are so many bigger projects I have to deal with but the storm door is an embarassment and is so visible, I just want it DONE!

I do have a concern about the warranty that the company coming tomorrow gives. It's only two years. That sounds pitiful.

[phillysleuth]

You might want to get a second quote. Also, is this a masonry opening or wood framed? I would get their opinions on packing the frame out or enlarging it. They might be able to pry a piece of trim loose on all the sides to see what framing is hidden by the trim.
If you're lucky and its already packed out you might be able to remove a few 2x framing members and pack it out with 1x or plywood to fit a 36" door. A home depot door + a Carpenter might come in cheaper than the original quote.

If I were a handywoman, or had a carpenter/contractor I trusted, I might go through the exploration of the reframing option, but I think at this point, it isn't worth the energy. I've had one other quote for a pretty basic door for about $600 installed, and it would have been made locally. But it was strictly from a brochure so I couldn't judge the quality, and then the really nice contractor who was completely professional, came prepared, knew the scope of the job, and gave me a ball park verbal quote, with a written one to follow in email, disappeared. Doesn't respond to phone calls, or email. Really discouraging because I had no clue that this wasn't going to be a done deal and I could use him for other work. (His company had installed the current rotted door and both the front and back doors about 10 years ago but I wasn't ranting and raving about it).

The actions of contractors make no sense to me any more; I don't know who to trust, since all the signs I normally would pick up on don't seem to make any difference now. In any event, I'm going to keep looking for a firm that will make this a nobrainer project, but I won't hold my breath until I see the estimate in writing and the door arrive. If they can do this, they can get more interesting, lucrative work. My health isn;t that great and I don't have the energy for games.

Thanks for the link. I'm going to use it to see what measurements I come up with independently. I may even talk to Home Depot or Lowes just to see what direction they would steer me, although there's very little likelihood I would use them. I've been scalded just a bit too much in the last few years by different types of screwy contractor behavior.

[sharkey]

If you frame down the opening to a standard size, you will lose some entry width. (Assuming it is the width that is irregular) This can cause a problem getting furniture and appliances in and out if it is already narrow. Home Depot doors are junk. Many are pressboard covered with vinyl. One small crack and the board gets wet and swells up. It also cracks easily. Even their better doors are secured with a Z hinge, which depends on a few sheet metal screws. When the screws work loose it is trash. Go to Oregon Windows at 7th and Oregon and get a custom sized, all aluminum door with a full piano hinge for around $200. They can also install.

[Brooke]

I've heard nothing but horror stories about Home Depot's subcontractors stinking. But Home Depot's custom ordering service is pretty good and quick. I just recently ordered two interior doors from them in custom sizes when independent lumber yards couldn't make them for me.

[phillysleuth]

The most recent measurement was for an 83" height door, so I don't know which is the real constraint. I hired a company yesterday, despite not finding the representative very pleasant. They have been around a long time, and are on Angies List with good reviews (but mostly for windows). He said contractors don't like to do small jobs, but his philosophy was that neighbors would see his truck and ask about other work. I don't know what a Z hinge is, but his door has a continuous hinge, which I think is what you mean by piano hinge. He brought the same brochure that the first contractor had (the one who disappeared) so when he gave me a higher price for the same door, I caught it. He tried to pass it off on a misunderstanding of which style I wanted, and I let it pass because I don't have any energy left for this project and am 95% sure I will get an acceptable door from him even though I obviously was just a nuisance client. It has a foam core so won't rot, and I'll have to get some kid to interchange the storm and screen once a year but it'll be good enough and free my mind up for bigger projects. He wasn't happy when I pulled out the 10% Angies List coupon offered by his firm. He acted like he hadn't ever seen it!

All Home Depot doors are junk? Even the Anderson and Emco lines? It's exhausting spending so much time on every little details of even the smallest home maintenance project! This seemed to be much easier 20-30 years ago when I remodeled both the kitchen and bathroom. I guess when you're younger, you have more patience for BS.

If you frame down the opening to a standard size, you will lose some entry width. (Assuming it is the width that is irregular) This can cause a problem getting furniture and appliances in and out if it is already narrow. Home Depot doors are junk. Many are pressboard covered with vinyl. One small crack and the board gets wet and swells up. It also cracks easily. Even their better doors are secured with a Z hinge, which depends on a few sheet metal screws. When the screws work loose it is trash. Go to Oregon Windows at 7th and Oregon and get a custom sized, all aluminum door with a full piano hinge for around $200. They can also install.

[phillysleuth]

Thanks for your feedback, Brooke. If I trusted my measuring accuracy, I might have, as a last resort, done this, but I'm just not handy with home repair projects. As you'll see from my other post, I hired someone yesterday. We'll see how they do on the quality and installation end in a couple of weeks.

I've heard nothing but horror stories about Home Depot's subcontractors stinking. But Home Depot's custom ordering service is pretty good and quick. I just recently ordered two interior doors from them in custom sizes when independent lumber yards couldn't make them for me.

[sharkey]

Check the hinges. If it is a Z-hinge I do not recommend it. You are depending on 6 or 9 sheet metal screw, which loosen up. A piano hinge is a continuous hinge that runs the height of the door and is secured the whole way with screws.

[sharkey]

I just got a call from Oregon Windows that the storm door I ordered Mon. is ready.

[phillysleuth]

My understanding is that it's a continuous hinge. I asked. The one I have now has about 4 hinges or so, but I haven't had problems with that aspect of it, just the rotting.

Check the hinges. If it is a Z-hinge I do not recommend it. You are depending on 6 or 9 sheet metal screw, which loosen up. A piano hinge is a continuous hinge that runs the height of the door and is secured the whole way with screws.

[phillysleuth]

Fast! Wish I had known about them earlier.

I just got a call from Oregon Windows that the storm door I ordered Mon. is ready.

[sawnhammers]

The reason HD has poor contractors is because it is a large company who bids on the contract then they sell it to someone else and then someone else until finally it's sold to some contractor who wishes he made more money. So he does the quickest cheepest job he can. just like cable contractors.
Try Miller's Family Contracting 215-783-5197. 3rd generation. Either custom doors. Or reframe the opening to fit.

[Tail]

I had a vestibule door, front door and storm door replaced by Lowes. I was shocked at how well the installer worked. Matter of fact, over the years, I've used many contractors, mostly local guys advertising in the FT Star, Spirit or NE Times and between the doors and a carpet, Lowes installers have done the best work out of any of the contractors.

I'm not just saying this to hype them up, I mostly do my own work, but when time doesn't allow it, I hire out the job. Lowes, hands down, has been the best. The only other contractor I thought did a good job was Preston, they hung sheetrock in a very high ceiling above a stairwell. Easy enough job though, cant really mess it up too bad, just too high for me.

[phillysleuth]

I'm waiting to hear from the contractor who I hired to do the door project. They use the same manufacturer that the guy who disappeared did and it was ordered about a week ago. After the job is done, I'll report back on how the experience went. I'm just crossing my fingers that there are no negative surprises because I have lots of other work I can't do.

I had a vestibule door, front door and storm door replaced by Lowes. I was shocked at how well the installer worked. Matter of fact, over the years, I've used many contractors, mostly local guys advertising in the FT Star, Spirit or NE Times and between the doors and a carpet, Lowes installers have done the best work out of any of the contractors.

I'm not just saying this to hype them up, I mostly do my own work, but when time doesn't allow it, I hire out the job. Lowes, hands down, has been the best. The only other contractor I thought did a good job was Preston, they hung sheetrock in a very high ceiling above a stairwell. Easy enough job though, cant really mess it up too bad, just too high for me.

[Reader]

Just wanted to report back that after all the headaches, the reinstalled door from the HD contractor is great. The guy who came out this time did very high quality work, looked at a lot of little details, and was really nice about it. It took a lot of time and phone calls, but HD and the contractor did work with me until it was right, with no attempt at all to charge us more money or anything. Since I bitched about the on here, only felt it was fair to report the end result.

[sawnhammers]

many older homes have odd sizes in their doorways and window openings. Construction techniqes and remodeling practices are very different. Most manufactures have a standard size designed on openings that were built present day. So yes special order is sometimes the only way. And most places charge much more for those sizes. Another option would be to reframe the opening. It may cost a slight more over all than a custom door may cost but there are benefits as well. Example standard sizeopenings meens you will be able to replace doors in the future without extra costs. Insulation and security would be another benefit. The size you stated is smaller in width but larger in height. Which seems to me that it would just need to be wider for you to be able to install a standard door. Besides im sure its difficult to get lafger things in and out stove refridge. Etc.... Call or email millersfamilycontracting@hotmail.com 2157835197. Much less than your estimate above

[enyo]

If anyone has a narrow door frame and needs the extra inches, wide throw or swing clear hinges are usually an option.
They'll give you 2" inches.