APA updates policy on male circumcision...

[toxigal]

APA circumcision policy

"Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks and that the procedure’s benefits justify access to this procedure for families who choose it."

I don't have strong feelings one way or another. i believe parents should be fully informed of the risks and benefits and then be left alone to make the decision. I understand the arguments against, i understand the arguments for and i just can't bring myself to get fired up for either side.

[AbortedWalrus]

I don't care if people choose it, it just shouldn't be done by default.

[raider.adam]

I don't care if people choose it, it just shouldn't be done by default.

Doctors will do it without parental consent?

[phillyaggie]

Doctors will do it without parental consent?

yeah, that seems unreasonable. i wonder if a doc can get sued for doing this obviously-optional procedure without first asking and receiving parental consent.

[Hospitalitygirl]

Doctors will do it without parental consent?

They don't. Parents need to sign off on this procedure.

[AbortedWalrus]

Doctors will do it without parental consent?

They used to, not really anymore. But I have heard of a lot of Doctors basically telling parents to get it done rather than informing them on the pros/cons and letting them draw their own conclusions as well.

[OffenseTaken]

They used to, not really anymore. But I have heard of a lot of Doctors basically telling parents to get it done rather than informing them on the pros/cons and letting them draw their own conclusions as well.

There's no law that says doctors can't have an opinion.

[phillyaggie]

There's no law that says doctors can't have an opinion.

no, but it's more about the ethics of their professional practice. the APA policy statement linked by toxigal also states that doctors should discuss this issue with parents and provide them pros/cons:


It
is important that clinicians routinely inform parents of the health
benefits and risks of male newborn circumcision in an unbiased and
accurate manner.

[ArcticSplash]

They used to, not really anymore. But I have heard of a lot of Doctors basically telling parents to get it done rather than informing them on the pros/cons and letting them draw their own conclusions as well.

In military hospitals at the time I was born it was certainly not optional. That changed to match civvy hospitals not long after I was born, though.

[toxigal]

But I have heard of a lot of Doctors basically telling parents to get it done rather than informing them on the pros/cons and letting them draw their own conclusions as well.

where have you heard a lot of doctors do this?

[Naveen]

Like a lot things these days, the US is lagging behind the rest of the developed world in the latest practices. It is no longer the norm in Anglophone countries, and has never been the norm in the rest of Europe, or in Japan.

Here rates vary based on region. In the western states, newborns who are circumcised are definitely in the minority (I mean, we're talking numbers like 11-20%) . It's still prevalent in the Rust Belt and parts of the South, but even the "new South" is lower than the Northeast.

Circumcision rates are incredibly low in the developing world, with the exception of the Muslim world, where the rates are obviously high because of religion.

[Sycamore]

I tend to have very strong opinions on genital mutilation.

[OffenseTaken]

Like a lot things these days, the US is lagging behind the rest of the developed world in the latest practices. It is no longer the norm in Anglophone countries, and has never been the norm in the rest of Europe, or in Japan.

Here rates vary based on region. In the western states, newborns who are circumcised are definitely in the minority (I mean, we're talking numbers like 11-20%) . It's still prevalent in the Rust Belt and parts of the South, but even the "new South" is lower than the Northeast.

Circumcision rates are incredibly low in the developing world, with the exception of the Muslim world, where the rates are obviously high because of religion.

If something was customary in the UK and Australia and isn't anymore, I don't see how "the US is lagging behind the rest of the developed world in the latest practices." That seems like a non sequitur. Also, it is still the norm in the biggest Anglophone country.

Ultimately, I'm just trying to see your point.

[Naveen]

If something was customary in the UK and Australia and isn't anymore, I don't see how "the US is lagging behind the rest of the developed world in the latest practices." That seems like a non sequitur. Also, it is still the norm in the biggest Anglophone country.

Ultimately, I'm just trying to see your point.

The US is the only developed country outside of S. Korea where it is still the normal practice, and it's fading fast here too.

I guess my point would be that it's a dying practice outside of areas where it's not done for religious reasons.

[FKD19124]

the people who seem strongly against this are the ones insisting it causes severe trauma to child for the rest of their lives.
Honestly, I have no recollection of it and I am living a pretty normal and healthy life.

APA circumcision policy

"Evaluation of current evidence indicates that the health benefits of newborn male circumcision outweigh the risks and that the procedure’s benefits justify access to this procedure for families who choose it."

I don't have strong feelings one way or another. i believe parents should be fully informed of the risks and benefits and then be left alone to make the decision. I understand the arguments against, i understand the arguments for and i just can't bring myself to get fired up for either side.

[OffenseTaken]

The US is the only developed country outside of S. Korea where it is still the normal practice, and it's fading fast here too.

It's fallen in and out of fashion in this country for a century. The main reason is incoming waves of recent immigrants, particularly from Catholic countries, who almost never circumcise and are overrepresented in maternity wards (particularly in the Western U.S. these days). White Protestants have overwhelmingly opted for circumcision since the late 1800's. There are minor fluctuations depending on the popular science of the time, just like there is with breastfeeding.

[AbortedWalrus]

where have you heard a lot of doctors do this?

I haven't heard that a lot of doctors do it, just heard a lot of stories from friends with kids and the like who said that's how it was presented to them. It could just be one of those cases where you only hear about it when there's something to actually complain about.

[Naveen]

It's fallen in and out of fashion in this country for a century. The main reason is incoming waves of recent immigrants, particularly from Catholic countries, who almost never circumcise and are overrepresented in maternity wards (particularly in the Western U.S. these days).

Not exactly sure what you're saying here. It's fallen both in and out of fashion for a century because of recent Catholic immigration? What? Or are you just attributing the decline to Catholic immigration?

Also, I'd add Asian immigration has probably caused it to decline too.

The next question would be, do 2nd generation parents continue not circumcising their 3rd generation kids?

White Protestants have overwhelmingly opted for circumcision since the late 1800's.

Do you have date for this? It would be interesting to see the data for whites by region. Also, is there any major difference between white Catholics and protestants on this these days?

[phillyaggie]

It's fallen in and out of fashion in this country for a century. The main reason is incoming waves of recent immigrants, particularly from Catholic countries, who almost never circumcise and are overrepresented in maternity wards (particularly in the Western U.S. these days). White Protestants have overwhelmingly opted for circumcision since the late 1800's. There are minor fluctuations depending on the popular science of the time, just like there is with breastfeeding.

so circumcision is connected to Protestantism, how? I'm trying to understand this since it's a new thing to me. And Catholics don't do this because it says to not do it in their version of the Bible? Or the two are at odds on this issue, simply because they're at odds with many other issues?!

I thought only Jews and Muslims had some sort of religious obligation to cut off their boy-child's foreskin, as some sign of respect to Moses, or something.


Since you bring up breastfeeding too, I wonder where the U.S. stands on that issue compared to other countries. Are breasts in America mostly there for fondling by men, or do people accept there is actual biological use for them?! What are the rates of formula feeding versus breastmilk... just wondering. this issue certainly seems to be a culture-driven thing.

[AbortedWalrus]

so circumcision is connected to Protestantism, how? I'm trying to understand this since it's a new thing to me. And Catholics don't do this because it says to not do it in their version of the Bible? Or the two are at odds on this issue, simply because they're at odds with many other issues?!

I thought only Jews and Muslims had some sort of religious obligation to cut off their boy-child's foreskin, as some sign of respect to Moses, or something.


Since you bring up breastfeeding too, I wonder where the U.S. stands on that issue compared to other countries. Are breasts in America mostly there for fondling by men, or do people accept there is actual biological use for them?! What are the rates of formula feeding versus breastmilk... just wondering. this issue certainly seems to be a culture-driven thing.

Wait, you mean... that's not the primary use for them?

Mind blown man, mind blown.

Actually I just read a new study that explained that the advantages of breast feeding may be in the microbiological environment that grows inside babies that are breastfed as opposed to those that take formulas.